Responding to Adversity Mindfully

Lindsay Miller  0:07  
You're listening to The Stress Nanny podcast and I'm your host, Lindsay Miller. I'm here to help you keep an eye on your family stress levels. In our fast paced lives, the ability to manage stress has never been more important for kids or adults. When it comes to stress, we have two choices we can decrease stress or increase our resilience to it. Here on the number eight ranked stress podcast I interview experts and share insights to help you do both. When you tune in each week, you'll bring your stress levels down and your resilience up so that stress doesn't get in the way of you living your best life. I'm so glad you're here. 

Hey, there this is Lindsay. Thanks for being here. I'm excited to share this episode with Kathleen Donnelly Israel. She walked the Camino, we'll talk about what that is, if you're not familiar with it, and whether or not you have an interest in the Camino or whether you're just taking your own unique journey through life. Her story has a lot of interesting wisdom and a lot of examples that we can take figuratively to help us move through whatever journeys or adversities we're facing. She made it through quite a rough stretch of life before taking your walk on the Camino. So she has a ton of wisdom to share. Enjoy the episode. 

Welcome to The Stress Nanny podcast. I'm your host Lindsay Miller and I'm delighted that you're here. I'm so excited to introduce my guest today Kathleen Donnelly Israel, she's lived her entire life in San Diego, California. She raised five children with her husband of 48 years Ron Israel. They were a team couple for worldwide Marriage Encounter. She graduated with a bachelor's degree in art from San Diego State University and studied expressive arts therapy at the European graduate school in Switzerland. She cared for her husband for the 17 years that he had Parkinson's disease till he died in 2018. During this time, she studied spiritual healing from many enlightened thought leaders and teachers. She wrote her book about her travels on the Camino Santiago in Spain and about sharing her wisdom with those she met there. Kathleen, thank you so much for joining me today.

Kathleen Donnelly  2:10  
Well, I'm so happy to be here.

Lindsay Miller  2:14  
So when I heard about Kathleen, she reached out had reached out to me and said, Hey, I have written this book. I was on the Camino. I'd love to, you know, chat with you on your podcast. And I was like, what, because I have wanted to walk the Camino for a number of years now. And so getting the chance to talk to Kathleen, today is a treat for me. And I hope that you will be just as enthusiastic about her wisdom as I am. But in order for people to understand, can you tell us a little bit about the Camino Cathleen for people who aren't familiar with it?

Kathleen Donnelly  2:49  
Okay, so back, like, in the time of Jesus, the Apostle James went to the Iberian Peninsula to, to try and convert people to believe in Jesus. And he wasn't very successful. So I went back to Jerusalem, and they murdered him. And so the story goes that the angels brought him back to Spain and buried him in Spain. But I mean, I'm thinking some people do that. And the angels help them something like that. And in the 1200s, they were trying to get the Moors out of Spain. So St. James appeared and help them in battle to get the Moors out of Spain. And all of a sudden, everybody really liked St. James. And they found his grave and they started to have pilgrimages to his grave. And that's how the Camino started. They use the Roman roads, to, you know, for people to come from everywhere. I mean, people go out their front door somewhere in Europe, and just walk from their house to Santiago for their pilgrimage. I came from the US. So I flew to San John Pye, deport and started there. It's really cool. You can just go online and they'll tell you how to get places. Yeah, so

Lindsay Miller  4:23  
it's a really what is it? 500 miles, how many miles? It's 600 miles?

Kathleen Donnelly  4:26  
Well, it's 580. Not 489 miles. Okay. If

Lindsay Miller  4:32  
you take the whole thing from like, Southern or southern funds into design,

Kathleen Donnelly  4:35  
no, it's from Northern. Yeah, southern France, northern Spain. Yeah. So from San John. It's called the French way. And you're walking right out of France, right as you get into France, because you go over the Pyrenees and you're in Spain. And so yep, that's how it is.

Lindsay Miller  4:58  
Yeah. So Okay, so it's like fast forward to now. And it's a very important pilgrimage, like you're saying, for, for individuals who practice Catholicism, right? It's like a pilgrimage you can make. And also, it's a place that's seekers go, right. It's not just you don't just find people who are wanting to go to visit the grave site. Now you find people who are like seeking something or just wanting to have an experience and it's deeply spiritual in in a lot of ways, right?

Kathleen Donnelly  5:31  
Absolutely. Only, like 1/3 of the people are Catholic. Like two thirds of the people on the Camino are not and, and like you say, they're on a spiritual journey, or else they're just like, I'm buff, I'm gonna go walk the Camino Santiago, you know, it's not. Everybody's got their own reason to be there. And a lot of times, people will have like, some trouble in their life and they're like, I need to get away from my life and walk the Camino. Yeah.

Lindsay Miller  6:01  
So okay, so I, you know, from your story, you walk the Camino after your husband's death. And one of the reasons that you, you had I'll let you I'll let you say it, so you and your husband had planned all these amazing adventures in retirement, and it didn't turn out quite that way.

Kathleen Donnelly  6:18  
Yeah, he. Yeah. Well, he was an athlete. So and I was one of the athlete, I mean, but we walked everywhere, all of our life. When we went on vacation, we walked in walked, and every night we went out and walked in our neighborhood. And we were walkers. And he was actually a runner, and a biker. And a swimmer, he did triathlons and, and stuff. And so I just, you know, thought to support him, that it would be really cool to ride our bicycles across France in our old age, and I had, you know, made up these big stories in my mind about it. And then when he got Parkinson's disease, I mean, he was diagnosed age 51. And he had it before that, we just didn't know what it was. And so then I was like, Okay, well, we're not going to be doing that. I mean, I even made up in my mind, okay, so I could ride my bike, and he could go in a band or something, you know, I mean, I was they had a stuff trying to make it work. But it didn't, it didn't turn out that way. And so. So anyway, when we went into his disease, I was, you know, I had to give that up. And he, he didn't want to be I, you know, when I found out about it, I'm like, Okay, where's the cure? Where's the cure? So I was finding cures, but he didn't want to do any of them. He just wanted to do the medical model of, of Parkinson's disease, and I am not even a pill taker. And here he was, you know, taking pills. And it was very frustrating for me. Yeah. Because his decision to go into his disease was the decision to take me with him. You know, because we, we had a marriage that was gonna stay, you know, I, you know, it was a no brainer for me. Yeah. So that's the way that was. Yeah. Which

Lindsay Miller  8:22  
I mean, part of there's so much richness in your story, like, we're only going to be able to just touch on the tiny bit of it today. But part of what I loved about your story was that like, in all the adventures that you had planned, like you ended up taking a different journey than the ones you had anticipated, right? Like you, you had anticipated certain journeys with your husband in your marriage in your years of retirement. And the journey that you ended up taking didn't didn't look like that for, like you're saying a variety of reasons, like the disease, and then the choices around how to manage it and everything. So in those moments, like, eventually, you get to take this journey, right, and you have at this point, full ownership of it. And you've come at it after, like these years of caring for him. And these years of really, it sounds like deep spiritual searching, because you're trying to reconcile this space you're in, where his disease is really kind of Ruling Your World. And you're trying to, like, extend love and compassion while simultaneously, you know, supporting him as he transitions into the next phase of his existence. And so, how, in those years, what how did you kind of keep yourself going? Because I mean, 17 years is not a short time, right? I mean, right? That's like the time. You know, some of us are raising kids at home, you know, it's that's a big stretch of yours. And so, what were some of the key things you learned in that stretch? And then I know that translates into your journey because you just kind of offered yourself up as a support to share those things with anyone you met along along your route on the Camino. I

Kathleen Donnelly  10:00  
write. So I had kind of a rough childhood. And I had post traumatic stress disorder from my childhood. And so when I had to be home with Ryan, and really just the last, I would say, from 2010 2008 team was when I had to take care of him, he could not do anything. But before that he was able to move around, he could drive, you know, stuff like that, but he was just getting worse all the time. And so in 2010, boom, he couldn't, couldn't do anything anymore. So anyway, I went online, and I studied with different thought leaders hoping to really cure myself, because I've been trying all my life and, you know, and, and so I listened to thought leaders on the internet, and every once in awhile, you would buy their program, and I would do their program, you know, sleep tapes, and listen to this, listen to that, read this, read that. And then I would get kind of bored. And God would bring me another teacher. And I would study their stuff. And it just over and over again, for like, eight years, that I, I felt like I had learned some stuff in those eight years, things that I could share with other people. And that's why I wanted to write the book was to share those things with other people. And I remembered that I had told people those things on the on the Camino. And so I thought, Oh, I'll write my book about walking the Camino and telling people those things. So my teachings hover around forgiveness, and the possibilities that exist for us in our life. So when we've had trauma, maybe we'll think the trauma is so big in our head that when we have a new experience, we will maybe impose the worry or something on new experiences, and then we can't have you know, we can't have an, the possibilities for ourselves, because we're corner shadowed by what we're afraid might happen. And so that's part of my message to people. Is that them for myself, I thought it was my I thought my sad story was important. And one time, somebody said, why don't you just make up a new story? And I'm like, well, that wouldn't be true. You know, and, and so when I started learning with those thought leaders, I realized that the sad story was keeping my life sad. And in order to have a happy life, I would have to change the way I thought and spoke. And I remember my husband, he was very advanced. I mean, he couldn't talk. But he was very advanced compared to me. And so when I would, somebody would come over, and I'd start telling him about my sad story. And he, like, took his hands and went like this, like this. Like, he didn't want me to do that. And it made me feel bad. Like he was trying to shut me off. And I thought that was important. But now I realize it's so it just makes more sadness in your life when you tell your story. And it makes sadness in that other person's life too. It's like a total low vibrational thing to be constantly telling the sad story. So so then I you know, and so I realized, okay, so Okay, got this ad story, it's on my head. I'm, I'm thinking it all the time, you know, it's color in my life, and I need to change my mind. So I, one of my teachers said, you have to think of find something good to think about and think it, you know, and just sort of get the sad things out of your consciousness. And, like you say, the live in reality, like, the reality is, I live in a house, you know, and I'm not I got food, I you know, and I can pay my bills. And, and so just to there's nothing wrong here, what I was what I want to say, or maybe there are some wrong things, but anyway, there I can think of some good things. And then when I think of good things, and then I can, it was so hard to change myself to not talk about those things anymore. But but I can do that. And so, so anyway, I just gradually I could make myself do that. Talk about things that are, you know, life giving and thinking about other people and thinking good things about them, instead of, you know, because a lot of times when people have trauma, they're just like, kind of intent on watching out for bad things that could happen. And, and so in that way, what you think about you bring about, so it's not going to be good. It's not going to be good. So that's what I one thing that I learned that I needed to change my mind. And while I was taking care of Ron, I mean, he was a lovely, lovely man, he and I got so lucky, I married somebody who loves the theater. And we would go to the Old Globe Theatre and watch the Shakespeare plays and the other plays and, and, you know, there were good things in my life. And so I needed to think about them, and I needed to share them with people instead of sharing my sad story.

Lindsay Miller  16:01  
Thanks for sharing that. And I think there's so much value in, like you're saying, acknowledging the sad story, because I think sometimes our response if we're trying to work through it, and trying to be positive is saying, like, trying to make it so it wasn't sad, like you mentioned are trying to, and like it can be sad. And then we can focus our mind and like our intention on something that's feeling that feels inspiring to us, or that leads us forward in a more hopeful way. And so I love that you're like, in the process of working through that you're acknowledging the sad parts, and then shifting your mindset into a space of more expansion and openness and hope. And like the goodness finding the things in your life that are nurturing to you that are bringing you joy.

Kathleen Donnelly  16:49  
Yeah. And like, the possibilities, like, if I just look at what has happened in the past, and project those things on the things that might happen in the future, that didn't even happen yet. Then I'm just making up a sad story and believing it. And it's not even true. So, so I need to make up a good story. It's just as valid as the sad story. And then I can, you know, perhaps bring some good things into my life with my high vibration. Yeah. Yeah. I

Lindsay Miller  17:21  
love that. And I think one of the ways that I've heard nervousness or worry conceptualized is that the feeling in the body is similar to excitement. It's just that with excitement, you know, there's going to be a good outcome. Hmm, yeah. Where you don't know the outcome. And so what I just heard you say was your took moments where you could have been kind of stewing in anxiety, and you created some, like, You created the excitement forward so that you knew the end result could be goodness, like you knew you could transition into excitement instead of worry. Because you were envisioning a future. That was something you were looking forward to.

Kathleen Donnelly  18:04  
Yeah, there's endless possibilities in front of us all the time.

Lindsay Miller  18:10  
Yeah. What What were some of the things you thought about as you made the decision to walk the Camino alone, because I know, you know, people walk it in a variety of ways. Some people solo some people in groups, some people, you know, it's just a couple. So, you know, first people who are trying to envision you, you're like, prepping, you're gonna, you know, in the book, you talk about getting your backpack and needing to go exchange it a couple times, because you needed to figure out like, what was going to be the best fit. Same with your close, like, you really just had to dive deep, and get to know what would work for you on your particular journey. But talk to us about that about deciding to go it alone.

Kathleen Donnelly  18:48  
Okay, so I did ask people to go with me. I wasn't worried about going by myself, but I did ask that well, okay, well, let's just, you know, do this and, and nobody could go, actually my sister in law, who was instrumental in my preparing because she thought, okay, Kathleen, you're gonna walk up mountains. So she took me walking up mountains in San Diego to prepare. But I didn't ask her because she has a problem with her fingers. They get cold and, and I knew it was going to be cold. And so I thought, Well, I I can't ask burn up. But before I left, she told me you know, Kathleen, the reason why I didn't ask if I could go with you is because I wanted you to have this time of reflection for yourself. If I was with you, then you we would be in our conversation, and you wouldn't have that reflection time. Okay, and then another reason is because, I mean, I was 69 years old, I had my 70th birthday on the Camino and I walk slow And if I took somebody with me, they would probably walk faster than me, we wouldn't be walking together anyway, or they would have to walk slow for me. So that was good. And also, I have four guardian angels that I know personally. And I brought them with me. And I wasn't afraid, because I had my guardian angels to protect me.

Lindsay Miller  20:22  
I love that I can really appreciate what you were saying, about going solo in terms of your own mindset. And like having your own being in your own head, which it sounds like during the time you were caring for your husband, there was a lot of that. And also the efforts were focused on being available for him and making sure he was okay. And I think sometimes in those moments when we slow down, like some of the things that we struggle with can catch up to us. So like, to me, it makes sense that your PTSD was something that felt really prevalent during those years, when you were kind of slowed down taking care of him like it was a space and time you could process it. And then again, on the on the Camino, like processing grief, and then also working through some of those teachings in a real time setting just seems like such an incredible gift that you gave to yourself. And then I also love that you could do it at your pace. You know, and I think sometimes in life, when we talk about taking journeys, through whatever hardship or struggle or you know, whatever thing we're processing, sometimes we want to, you know, have someone else right there by us guiding us, we're holding our hand, or we want to have someone else right there by us, like hustling us through or we feel like we need to do it at someone else's pace. And I think in life and in struggle, it's important for us to honor, honor our own pace. And so I'm glad you did that. And then also that you had the foresight and the just that deep connection to feel the support that you did have and to focus on that instead of kind of feeling the absence of support, like you, you found the support where you knew it, it was. Yeah. Um, what, what are some of the things that you did as you prepped, so you said, you walked up the mountains, you, you know, you were getting your gear ready to go, what else?

Kathleen Donnelly  22:25  
Well, in the beginning, while I was taking care of Ron, I could leave in the morning, and I would go walk with my friend on the bay in San Diego, and we would walk five miles in the morning. And I didn't even break a sweat, I wasn't tired. And I thought oh, I can do this. I can walk five miles before lunch five miles after lunch, I can do this. And also, I I worked at a horse ranch, it was a horse ranch for autistic children. And so they needed volunteers and I cleaned the you know, the stalls and I had a really strong core big from Wheeling that wheelbarrow of hosts, horse pucky all over the place. And so I was pretty buff myself even though I while I took care of Ron my health went way down. I mean, I looked old when I was carrying I looked older than I do now. My health, I had so many health problems, I could hardly eat anything because I was allergic to everything. And so and I knew it was stressed. I knew it was stress and and and I just accepted and I'm like okay, well this is how it is right now I yeah and then after Ron died I had a lot of things to do. Like the funeral, the grave site, the bank, the insurance all this thing by January I was done with all that. And so that's when I started to prep and I went to a lecture at the library about how to pack light for the Camino and the lady at at the library told me all kinds of things that were very helpful like she told me where to stay when I went to sonshine and how to pack light she she had two shirts and she said okay, this is a T shirt so feel it now this is a T shirt that you should take on the Camino feel how much lighter it is. So this is what you need to find. You need to find lightweight clothing. So when I found my clothing i i went online and I I always looked to see how much it weighed and then I like put in sun protection shirt lightweight, you know and then my size and and I would you know that's how I found the clothes. And the same with the pants and And anyways, so I I collected everything I needed. I actually took only one bar of soap and I washed my hair, my teeth, my body, my clothes with this one bar soap, and I got my hair cut really short. So I could just use a little comb, because I didn't want to take a bunch of stuff because you don't want to carry all that stuff. And I wanted to carry my pack. That's what I wanted to do. Yeah, you don't have to, you know, over there, you can have it transported for you, you could actually even just take a suitcase, because you could just have it transported from place to place and take a little you know, just a day pack. You can do that. But I, I didn't want to do that I wanted to have the experience of backpacking.

Lindsay Miller  25:39  
Yeah, well in I mean, again, this idea of navigating something challenging, right, and how, in some moments, we have to really pare down, like the things that we're prioritizing, right. So in any challenging journey that we take in our lives, sometimes we really have to like, what is coming with me here and what what is no longer necessary. And so just the, you know, figuratively, and literally the way that you know, you navigated that process, where you had to just look at everything really, really carefully and be super intentional about what was going to be supportive to you on the journey you were on. And then, you know, making decisions around what was actually not going to be supportive to you and what was going to kind of weigh you down or hold you back from the experience you wanted to have. And I think sometimes in life, we can bring so many things in right, we live in a time when you can bring in so much information and stuff, that sometimes we can be kind of encumbered by all of that stuff. And we the simplicity of the Camino is something I really love about it. Because you do have to be so I mean, like you said, you don't have to be you can do, you know, you can do it however you want. And you can have as much stuff as you want and have someone help you take it. But if you take that solo route, like you did with the backpack, you have to be intentional about what what goes with you.

Kathleen Donnelly  27:02  
Yeah, I mean, I went to Europe with just hiking boots and shower shoes, that was my feet, you know, and, and I had my clothes on me and two changes, you know, when to wash when to wear, you know, when to let dry. And, you know, same with the socks, and you know, just three sets of clothes all together, including what I had on. And I went to Paris for a week with those clothes on. And I went to Scotland afterwards for a month with those clothes on. So it was just like, I just, you know, that's how I was for three months with those clothes and those shoes.

Lindsay Miller  27:44  
Yeah. Well, and again, I think that one of the things that I'm so enamored with on the Camino and you can tell me your experience with this I would love to hear it is the idea that like, there's so much synchronicity on the trail, right? Like, there are people kind of looking there are people who are there to help. So for people who don't know, right there hostels or hotels or families that will kind of take you in because it's like a 40 plus day journey. And so if you, if you can get onto the Camino, there are always people who can kind of support you along the way. Right, which I think is another great analogy for life.

Kathleen Donnelly  28:24  
I know you know, it's so funny. I went I went to the Camino and Liz and Portugal last year and then next year, I would love to go on the Camino del Norte but I am not I am old, I do not walk 35k in a day and some of the play on the Camino del Norte you have to walk from one abrogate to the next is 30 35k And so I was just worried about it. I didn't know what to do. And somebody I just was talking to somebody recently and they said the Camino provides just go to a bar and say is there anybody that can let me sleep somewhere you know, and you'll find a place and I'm just like, that's really scary because I did not do that I had all the where all the places I went to there was a place to stay. And really last year on the Camino Portuguese there were some stretches that were like 35 miles and I walked as far as I could took a bus back to the last abrogate stayed there another night and took the bus back to there and then walk you know, walk to the next place. So there was a little bit because of the COVID You know, not all the places were open. So

Lindsay Miller  29:47  
I think there's so much value in doing the Camino however you will, you know, whatever feels comfortable to you. I just love the I love that phrasing though the Camino provides because there are just like stories that I've read where people You know, you're looking for something, you make the connection, someone shares something with you, you know, it's an insight or it's a bit of wisdom or it's an experience that, that, you know, the Camino provides to you, or it's a space to stay, or it's, you know, there's just so many different ways, when you have that kind of faith and trust in the process. And when you're around other people who were kind of just seeking, you know, in whatever way they're seeking, that there's, there's beauty, so much beauty that can emerge from that.

Kathleen Donnelly  30:28  
And also surrender to the process. Like, not needing to be in charge, and not needing to know what the next thing is and realizing the possibilities. Yeah, it is scary. But you know, what, it's, it makes you grow. And it makes and God takes care of us. I mean, when I first started the first camino i, I was like, I didn't really believe that there would always be a place for me. And so I was like, looking around and looking, oh, there's a porch. I could like sneak under that porch and sleep there at night or some, you know, yeah, I was like, looking around and just noticing the possibilities that if this didn't turn out good, something I could do something, you know, but yeah, I never had to do that.

Lindsay Miller  31:29  
That phrase was so good, though, what you just said, I mean, because it tethers to what you were saying earlier, like looking for the possibilities, and knowing that there would be something good that we would find, and I'm just curious how you feel like that. That kind of mindset over the course of your journey helped helped you. You know, like you're saying before, you had to change your mindset to look for the good. And it sounds like on the Camino every day, the process was, like, I'm gonna have what I need when I need it. And I'm gonna look for it. And in life, I think a lot of times we get stuck, like you said earlier, like, I don't have this thing that I need. So do you feel like after you got back from the Camino, and you'd had that mindset for so, so long, that it became more natural, like, what I need is going to find me what I need is going to be right here.

Kathleen Donnelly  32:15  
Yeah. I, that. I always thought that because of my history of abuse, nobody could expect me to be vulnerable, to go into vulnerability. But you know, what, that's where it's at, you know, that's where the creative place is. It's in your vulnerability. Because if you have to, I mean, I have this philosophy about God. And God creates the world through us through our genius that God created. So, you know, like, I believe that sort of waiting around to see what God wants me to do is like a cop out. Because I need to engage in my life, and use my genius to go forward in my life, and allow God to create the world through me. And when I do that, I allow God, wonderfulness to be the creation in my life. And so when I'm thinking, I need this, I need that, you know, I and I, and I can't be vulnerable because I have all this pain inside of me and I, you know, I can't breathe if I'm stressed out. No, I need to give that up and allow myself to be vulnerable. So I can live and be the creation God intends.

Lindsay Miller  33:54  
That's so beautiful. Thank you for sharing that. As you were navigating the Camino, who were some some of the people that you met that were really memorable.

Kathleen Donnelly  34:06  
Oh my gosh, there's so many of them. There was a lady in there was a lady lady in I forget the name of the town anyway, we were in a monastery together and we were kind of like she was there just to help her friend she had already done the Camino and her friend let her do the Camino. She was there to help her friend do the Camino and and so she was just, you know, sort of hanging out in the kitchen, and I was making my food and I brought, I went up to the store and bought the food I needed and I bought a cake. It was my mother's birthday. And so I brought this cake back to the aggregate and put it on the table and I told everybody, you know, it's my mother's birthday, please and Joyce some of this cake with me. And, and she said, Wow, you must have really had a good relationship with your mother. I it was the first was the first anniversary of her birthday since she died. So she had died the year before. And I just felt like I needed to get a cake on her birthday. And so she said, Well, you must have had a really good relationship with your mom. And I said, No, not really, you know, we did not have a good relationship. And, and she's, she said, Yeah, I didn't either. So it was like we had a little bit of a camaraderie together in that. And so I shared the whole oponopono with her. Do you know what the whole oponopono is? Have you have

Lindsay Miller  35:53  
heard it, but I don't remember what it is like the phrase I've heard before. But please share.

Kathleen Donnelly  35:57  
So it's a Hawaiian healing technique for the family. So it's like a prayer or an incantation, whatever you like. And it starts out I love you. And it's I love you, I love God, God loves me, God loves the other person, the other person loves God. And I love that other person, if you can say that. And they love me. And then I love you, I'm sorry. And it's not I'm sorry, I did something, it's I'm sorry, the situation exists with me. And that other person, or some me in the world, or whatever it is, you know, I love you, I'm sorry, please forgive me for what's going on in me that caused me to attract this because I have some low vibrational thing going on inside of me, that cause me to attract this discontent that I'm having right now. So it's like taking responsibility for bringing in the stuff that isn't, you know, happy. I love you. I'm sorry, please forgive me, thank you. And it's I thank you for showing me this so I could heal. So if this person hadn't ruined my life today. In this way, I wouldn't see the pain that I have in myself that I needed to heal. So thank you for showing me this so I could heal. And when I say that, I feel it washes me, the washes me because I can, I can heal myself. And I can ask for forgiveness for this low vibration. And it's not about shame at all. I am not responsible for having this low vibration. I'm just trying to do the best I can here. And I have a low vibration. Because I came in with a low vibration, I attracted all kinds of crap in my life. And I didn't know that wasn't good to talk about it. So I'm just perpetuating this here. And please forgive me. Taking responsibility, I prefer not to be a victim. And in this, I'm not shaming myself. But I'm taking responsibility and not just being blaming and being a victim. So and then the big I Love You Again, I love God, God loves me. God loves the other person, the other person loves God, I love them. You can probably say that by then, after acknowledging that they're just doing what they do. I mean, maybe they tried to hurt you, maybe. But that's not necessarily something that we can judge about another person, sometimes they're just acting out because they've got pain. I mean, most of the time, I would say all the time, but anyway. So that's the whole oponopono. And so I shared that with that lady. And so even though our parents, our mothers were both dead, you don't have to do it with the person you can do it with, because we're sort of bound to the people that ruin our life. They signed up to show us our pain. And we signed up to let them show us our pain. So it sort of the whole oponopono loose this those binds, it loosens them, so we're not we're not stick to them anymore in a spiritual sadness. And it's a cleansing, cleansing. And I found that I had to do that a lot. For years. I did that every time. Some sad thing my monkey mind would bring in a sad thought. And I would be like, Ah, right, I'm thinking sad things again, I'm gonna bring in some bad stuff. Or maybe I'd stepped my toe and I'm like, Ah, what was I thinking sad that brought that pain into my life. You know, or, I mean, I really notice And I think it's a gift from God that I noticed. But anyway, whatever. And anyway, so I shared that with her. And, you know, I wrote it down for her. And so that was really lovely that I got to share that with her. And it's not, it's not about shame at all. It's about taking responsibility, and honoring our valiant spirit, who was willing to be here, so that our spirit could raise the vibration.

Lindsay Miller  40:33  
Yeah, thank you for sharing that. I really, really love what you were saying about just being able to connect deeply with the inherent need behind the the feeling you were having. So like, when you're sharing that prayer, going through those different steps, helps to kind of separate it out into the pieces of hurt that might be kind of swirling, swirling around. And like you said, kind of acknowledging and processing each one and letting it go. And then allowing yourself to move forward in a different way afterwards that has more autonomy that has like you sounded like you had more choice, because you because because of that practice, you were able to separate yourself a little bit from the other person's actions, and then you could move forward with a different kind of choice and a different kind of empowerment.

Kathleen Donnelly  41:18  
Yeah, it's very empowering. Yeah. Yeah. Thank you, God.

Lindsay Miller  41:25  
Well, this is yeah, I mean, the adventures you had were countless, right? Can you can you just share one adventure that like is so memorable from your time on the Camino?

Kathleen Donnelly  41:37  
Um, well, one time I was walking out in the middle of nowhere, and I was just walking and walking, you know, you're, you're watching the yellow arrows. There's the yellow arrows everywhere. And you see when you go the way it points you and then hopefully, you'll see the next arrow and I'll point you in another direction and I just walking across this giant field. And I saw it in the in far off, I saw this ruins it was look like a castle. And it had beautiful spires and arches. And it was it was just beautiful. And it wasn't so large. It was it was it was a castle, obviously. So when I got closer, I saw a sign and it said it was a convent. And so I walked up to it that the trail went right through it. So I walked through one of the arches on the trail, and I heard irish fairy music with harps and flutes, and it was so lovely. I was like, oh, here I am walking through this beautiful, you know, building that's a ruins. And then I looked over to the right and there was this guy, Filipino guy dressed in a white t shirt and a kilt. And he was behind a counter it was like a refrigerated counter type of thing. And he was making egg salad sandwiches and putting them in little bags to sell to the pilgrims and he had this big pot of coffee behind him on the counter just groaning away brewing the coffee. And so I went up to him. I mean, one of the problems with being on the Camino is there's no restrooms you have to go in the bushes, but every once in a while you can find a restroom. So I said do you have a restroom and he pointed over there was a trailer over there and I took care of to take care of that and I came back and I bought a cup of coffee from him. And he had a watermelon there he was going to cut it up for people and there were some tables to sit down and it was just like the most amazing off the wall lovely thing that I was just like I couldn't believe you just like this is just really special. And then I you know, I took my coffee and I walked on. But it was just like, there was just like some things like that on the Camino. It was another time I was walking up on a mountain and I came to this place and there were all kinds of like little I would say like booths or something but they had benches and then they had like Persian rugs hanging above you know, like a backdrop and there was just like all these different you know, things to see and and they had food there. They weren't taking any money they didn't want your money and they just set that up so people could be with each other and people were walking up the mountain they were tired and they got there there was a bench to sit on and some lovely scenery around there were rose bushes and and So I went up to this guy, and I said, Will you take my picture? And so I gave him my phone. And so he took my picture a couple of times in front of this Persian rug, you know, on a bench. And then he came back to give me my, my phone back. And what he did was he put his arm around me, and he took a selfie of the two of us. So I still remember him, because I still have that picture, you know? And it was just like, oh, he was very creative.

Lindsay Miller  45:31  
Yeah, yeah, I will. I love that I, again, the idea that like in our journey through life, there are a variety of people that we come across or meet. And then there are other people there that like helped make the way easier for us, right. And I love those experiences you described where it was unexpected, and there wasn't anything that would have prepared you for meeting up with these people. But you were receptive and open to the generosity that found you. And the connection that came as a result of just being at the same space at the same time.

Kathleen Donnelly  46:01  
Yeah, you know that a good goal for life is to experience astonishment. Astonishment is lovely. So, I had a lot of astonishment on the Camino.

Lindsay Miller  46:14  
Yes, well, I wish we could talk about all the stories, there are so many things in your book were, you know, the connections you made with people and then the things that you saw on learned I? Do you want to tell people where they can find the book, how they can connect with you

Kathleen Donnelly  46:29  
to learn, yeah. So if you go to Amazon, you can get my book wisdom on the Camino, by Kathleen Donnelly, Israel, you just put wisdom on the comm CAPM, and it comes up, you know, it's there. But also, I have a website wisdom on the camino.com. And you can just click the button there and and go to it. In my book, there, I have a gift for my readers. And people told me, you should put your pictures, because if I shared my pictures with people on Facebook while I was gone, I told all my friends, you need to pray for me while I'm over there. And so I shared my story on my pictures with my friends and, and they were like, Oh, you got to put the pictures in the book. And I'm like, yeah, and then it'll be $50, nobody will buy it. And so I made a website with galleries and portfolios. And, like, I put the pictures according to the chapters. So what you have to do is in the book, right across from the table of contents, there's a thing that says read this first. And you you have to double opt in to see the pictures. So I'm sorry about that takes a little bit of rigmarole, but that's the way it is. And, and then you can see the pictures while you're reading. So that's my gift to my readers.

Lindsay Miller  47:53  
Well, that's fantastic. Thank you again, so much for your time, and for the wisdom that you shared with us today, Kathleen, I really appreciate it.

Kathleen Donnelly  48:02  
Oh, I was so happy to be here. Thank you.

Lindsay Miller  48:07  
So in thinking about your own journey through life, I'm curious which of the snippets of wisdom that Kathleen shared resonated most with you, or what part of her story and resilience was supportive to you as you try to navigate your own moments of adversity, she had a variety of things that she faced that were really, really challenging. And I think that there's so much humanity in that. And when we can tune into that vulnerable part that we have within us, we can access the wisdom to help us move through it. 

You've just finished an episode of The Stress Nanny podcast. So hopefully you feel a little more empowered when it comes to dealing with stress. Feel free to take a deep breath and let it out slowly as you go back to your day. I'm so glad you're here. If you're a longtime listener, thank you so much for your support. It really means the world to me. If you're new, I'd love to have you follow the podcast and join me each week. And no matter how long you've been listening, please share this episode with someone who is stressed out. If you enjoyed the show, would you please do me a favor and go to ratethispodcast.com/thestressnanny and leave a review. The link is in the show notes. I'm so grateful for all my listeners. Thank you again for being here. Until next time!

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